In my previous post from earlier today, I mentioned that Shawn Barber had jumped 19-3, and that if the meet were considered legal, that it would set several records.
Well, I've got that information, and a whole bunch more!
It seems the Pole Vault, as in 2014, is the HOT event again this year!
So much so that I believe it deserves this "extra" post!
First, the results from that spectacular meet--the Expo Explosion VI in Benton TX!
Yes, Shawn Barber's 19-3 Vault is the new Collegiate Record!
It's also the Collegiate Junior Class record.
And the Canadian National record--the first vault over 19 feet by a Canadian!
And you can add the Age 20 record to the list!
But Barber wasn't the only hot vaulter there!
Sam Kendricks finished 2nd to Barber, with a jump of 18-9.
This moves him to 8th A-T Collegiate!
Two HS'ers jumped 17-3!
Brandon Bray and Pauli Benavides are now both 13th A-T HS, and both are tied with 3 others, including each other!
On the Women's side, there was a major upset, as the CR holder, Kaitlin Petrillose, was defeated by Stephen F Austin Junior Demi Payne, who vaulted a great 14-9!
This makes her 5th A-T Collegiate, tied with 4 others!
And it places her 19th A-T US, tied with 2 others.
BTW, Petrillose vaulted 13-9!
That wraps up the Texas meet!
But there was a meet in Arkansas where 2 HS girls had excellent marks!
In fact, these 2 girls have the same last name!
Yes, they are TWINS!
Lexi Weeks and Tori Weeks both vaulted 14-0.50!
This places both as 4th A-T HS, tied with....each other!
Talk about sibling rivalry----er, unity!!
Those were the results in this one event on this one weekend in the 1st week of January!
But let's look a bit at the larger picture in this exciting event.
First, I'll do a brief review of the OUTdoor PV, the Men first.
The OUTdoor WR is 20-1.75 by Sergey Bubka in 1994.
The American Record is Brad Walker's 19-9.75 from 2008.
The Collegiate Record is Lawrence Johnson's 19-7.50 from 1996.
The HS record is Shawn Barber's 18-3.50 from 2012!
It takes a vault of 17-6 to make the HS Top 24 list!
Eight HS vaulters have cleared 18 feet OUTdoors!
It takes a vault of 18-7.25 to make my Collegiate DDD.
Six Collegiate Men have jumped 19 feet OUTdoors.
You need a jump of 19-0.25 to make the US Top 24 list.
Seven Americans have cleared at least 19-6 OUTdoors!
It takes a 19-5.50 vault to be a World DDD lister!
Only 7 have reached 19-9 OUTdoors!
Now for the OUTdoor scene on the Women's side.
The WR is Yelena Isinbayeva's 16-7.25, dating from 2009.
The US record is Jenn (Stuczynski) Suhr's 16-1.75 from 2008.
She wasn't SUHR yet then! (My FINAL Suhr joke....maybe!!)
The Collegiate Record is Tina Sutej's 15-1.50 from 2011.
And the HSR is Desiree Freier's 14-7.25 from 2014.
It takes a vault of 13-6.25 to make the OUTdoor HS DDD.
Eight girls have cleared at least 14-0 OUTdoors.
You need a jump of 14-5.25 to make the Collegiate OUTdoor list.
Only 3 women have vaulted 15-0 OUTdoors.
It takes a 14-7.50 to make the US Top 24.
(But that will change fast! 23rd place is 14-9!)
Just Suhr has vaulted 16 feet, and only 6 Americans have made at least 15-3!
It takes a 15-5 to make the World OUTdoor list.
There have been 4 sixteen footers so far!
Now let's go where the NOW action is----INdoors!
Again, the Men go first.
I know it's been repeated a gazillion times, but the WR is now Renaud Lavillenie's 20-2.50 from 2014!
The AR is Jeff Hartwig's 19-9 from 2002.
The Collegiate Record is.....Shawn Barber's 19-3.....from 2015!!
And the HSR is Devin King's 17-10.25 from 2014!
You need a 17-1 vault to make the HS Top 24 list.
There are 7 guys who have cleared at least 17-6 INdoors.
It takes at least 18-6 to make the INdoor Collegiate list.
Just 6 have cleared 19-0 or more INdoors.
It takes 18-9.50 to make the US DDD list.
Only 5 Americans have done 19-3 or higher INdoors!
It takes a vault of 19-4.25 to make the World DDD.
Two----and you know who they are!!----have jumped 20 feet INdoors!
In my previous post, I listed all the numbers from my T&F Record Book, decade by decade.
Well, let's take a deeper look at the INdoor numbers for the PV.
The World INdoor Top 24 actually has 27 athletes listed, because of ties!
Over half of them--14, to be exact--date from the 20th century!
And 5 of those are from the 1980's!
The Americans fare worse!
Of the 24 marks on the list (no extras from ties), 15 are from 1999 or earlier!
Worse yet, only ONE dates from after 2009, Brad Walker's 19-2.75 from 2012!
The Collegiate Men are only slightly better than the Americans.
Of their 24, there's 14 dating from the last century!
And 6 of those are from the Big Hair decade!!
(The 80's, for those culturally deprived! LOL)
There are 25 HS guys on my list, due to ties.
While they rate the best, there's still 5 from the last century, with Joe Dial's 17-4.50 the oldest, dating from 1981!
Last, but definitely NOT least, here's the Women's INdoor stats!
The World Record belongs to Jenn Suhr, her 16-5.50 dating from 2013.
Of course, the American Record is the same!
The Collegiate Record is Kaitlin Petrillose's 15-1 from 2014.
And the HSR is Desiree Freier's 14-6, also from 2014.
(Remember, this happened during an OUTdoor meet, in which the PV was moved INdoors because of lousy weather!)
On the HS DDD list for INdoors, it takes a vault of 13-3 to make it there.
There are now SIX girls---including the most recent jumps by the Weeks twins!---who have cleared at least 14-0 INdoors!
There are 26 Women on the Collegiate DDD, due to ties.
It takes a jump of 14-3.50 to make that list.
And of those, just one has cleared at least 15-0.
But 9--including Payne's PR--have done 14-9 or higher!
It takes 14-7.25 to make the US Top 24 list---which is actually 25 strong, as there are ties!
Only Suhr has gone 16-0 or better, but 12 have now done 15-0 or more.
(But just 5 of those have done 15-3 or higher!)
You need 15-3.50 to make the World Top 24!
Just Suhr and Isinbayeva have gone over 16-0 INdoors.
And 7 have done 15-9 or higher.
The World DDD is TOTALLY in this century!!
The oldest mark is from 2002.
Fifteen Women's marks are from THIS decade, meaning from 2010 to now!
The United States is ALSO completely in the 21st century!!
They have 3 marks dating from 2002, the oldest.
And they match the World Women, as there are also 15 dating from 2010 forward!
Of the 26 Women on the Collegiate list, the oldest is ALSO from 2002!
And a whopping 19 are from 2010 or later!
Twelve of these are from 2013, 2014, or THIS year (Payne)!
Keeping with the other 3 groups, the HS Girls Top 24 are all from the 21st century.
But only 13 date from this decade!
However, of those 13, a full 11 of them are from 2013, 2014, or 2015 (the Weeks twins!!).
Oh, BTW, the oldest here is ALSO from 2002, she being the pioneering Samantha Shepard!
In conclusion, we see that the PV---for Men and Women, both OUTdoors and INdoors--is one of, if not THE, most dynamic events in Track and Field!
Yes, there are other DDD lists that are totally from the 21st century (the Men's Marathon, for example!), but the PV surely rates VERY high on the short list of fastest-evolving events!
What took place in those 2 meets in Texas and Arkansas this weekend surely show that it's only getting better....FAST!
It's just the first week of January!
Most of the HS'ers and the Collegians won't REALLY start their INdoor season until mid-January!
And the World and US vaulters won't rev it up until toward the END of this month!!
Stay tuned for a MASS revision of ALL of my PV records and lists in the coming months!
Hi aaronk,
ReplyDeleteGreat post! Thank you for all the fascinating data!
It still seems that the collegiate women are lagging a bit. Hopefully the recent HS stars will remedy that when they're in college. I'll be interested to see what Desiree Freier can do this year. I'd love to see her get 15', which would undoubtedly make her the shortest vaulter ever to clear that height, male or female. She's done a great job so far in overcoming that drawback, but eventually it will be a limitation. There are certain aspects of the mechanics of the event where short stature is a definite disadvantage. It's not inconsequential that Jenn Suhr is 6' tall! Isinbayeva is pretty tall too. I wonder how tall the Weeks twins are? The video of their great vaulting this weekend is quite revealing. They have very good technique, especiallly at the all-important takeoff, but both look like they could benefit hugely from more strength work. That means that they have a lot of upside potential.
Of course the reason that all of the women's vaults are 21st century is that the event is new. It was just getting started in the 90's, and it's only in the last decade that the event has come of age. The first-ever Olympic women's vault competition wasn't until 2000. There have only been three Olympic champions in the event ever and they are three of the event's greatest stars -- Stacy Dragila (2000), Yelena Isinbayeva (2004 and 2008), and Jenn Suhr (2012).
The women who have most dominated the vault for years at the world level -- Isinbayeva, Suhr, Feofanova, and Murer -- are all over 30 and either retired (Isinbayeva?) or on the downslope of their careers. Silva is probably the best bet to lead the event this year -- she's fast and strong -- but we should also be seeing more new faces at the top of the event.
Yes, it's going to be fun to follow this event this year!
How can you say the Collegiate women are lagging?
ReplyDeleteRead what I wrote again!
Of the 26 women on my DDD (INdoors!), 19 are from 2010 or later, and 12 of those are 2013-2015!
That's the best percentage of the 4 groupings (World, IS, Collegiate, HS)!
Should read (World, US...), not IS.
ReplyDeleteBut the heights for the collegiate women are not great. They're not that much ahead of the HS girls, at least when compared with the differential in heights between the HS boys and collegiate men. There are far too few collegiate women over 15', which is still a relatively inferior mark to men over 19', which many collegiate men have achieved indoor and outdoor. It's way too easy to make your collegiate women's DDD lists, so the recent marks are a trend in the right direction, but still seriously lagging.
ReplyDeleteYou're right....to a degree.
ReplyDeleteOf course, you have to keep in mind the newness of female PVing, it (seriously) beginning only around 1998!
Other "new" events (women's 3K SC for example) are also not where they should be.
We should have a lot more women running 9:10 or faster.
Too, keep in mind that collegians aren't all US--so you can't really measure US progression in the PV against Collegiate progression.
(Same for every collegiate event, men and women!)
But I return to the reason I did this extra post.
When was the last time you saw SEVEN athletes (Barber, Kendricks, Bray, Benavidi, Payne, both Weeks girls) set records and/or make my Top 24's this early in the INdoor season!
Look at the schedule in the latest T&FN----they don't even list any meets prior to January 16th!!
This season has been phenomenal!!
Starting with Ryen Frazier's 4:44 mile on NOVEMBER 22nd (!!!), and continuing with those fast 5K's, and all the other marks in December, then having this incredible DAY of PVing.....2015 INdoors is looking to be off the charts!!
Keep the faith!!
LOL
I agree that this season is off to a good start, and I'm enjoying that as you are.
ReplyDelete"Of course, you have to keep in mind the newness of female PVing, it (seriously) beginning only around 1998!"
Of course I AM keeping that in mind -- I mentioned this fact in my comment. It's one of the reasons that the women, generally, are still lagging the men.
However, as I pointed out in my comment, the lag seems to be greater among the collegiate women (for reasons that I think could be illuminated if we were to do a thorough analysis). As an illustration of this situation, the difference between the WRs (absolute) for men and women is 3' 7.25". The difference between the men's and women's CRs (absolute) is a whopping 4' 6"!!! Actually, the higher the heights, the greater the spread should be (because the same percentage difference produces a larger value at greater heights), but here we have the reverse -- by a very large margin. This is a clear indication of one way in which the collegiate women are lagging.
Above I showed how the WR differentials between men and women illustrate the fact that while women are rapidly gaining parity with men in this event, the collegiate women are lagging behind in this regard. Another way of illustrating the same point is the following:
ReplyDeleteIt takes a vault of 18' 7.25" to make your men's collegiate (outdoor) DDD list. This height is well ABOVE the HS record for boys.
It only takes a vault of 14' 5.25" to make your women's collegiate (outdoor) DDD list. This height is well BELOW the HS record for girls.
My first example (world records) illustrated how the collegiate women are lagging behind the elite pro women in the event. My second example (collegiate DDD lists) is an illustration of how the collegiate women are lagging behind the high school girls.
Further examination of the data you have provided only goes to make the point even stronger. I'm not going into the REASONS why I think this lagging is occurring, only pointing out that it IS occurring. That's why I made the comment in the first place and expressed my hope that the new crop of young women vaulters will eventually remedy this situation!
This discussion has moved me to do a bit of research.
ReplyDeleteHere's the COMPLETE list of the women who are on both the HS AND Collegiate lists, both indoors and outdoors.
INdoors
LeLeux (13-7 HS in 10 to 14-4 Coll in 13)
Laurent (13-9.25 HS in 08 to 14-3.50 Coll in 10)
That's it for indoors!!
Outdoors
LeLeux (14-2.75 HS in 11 to 14-6.75 Coll in 12)
Weygandt (14-0 HS in 09 to 14-9 Coll in 12)
Petrillose (13-8 HS in 11 to 14-9 Coll in 14)
And that's it for outdoors!
Of course, you have all the new women (Freier, Weeks twins, Draxler etc) who are either still in HS or are just frosh at some college, and haven't even competed yet as collegians!
Anyway, given all those caveats, it's NOT a good record of women's progression from HS to Collegiate ranks!!
Could be lots of reasons.
Injuries, going from trusted coach to someone new, academic overload, bad luck, getting married/pregnant, or just delayed development!
Add to above------another reason so few women are on both HS and collegiate lists-----collegians include several foreigners, so tough to compete against the WORLD (world of college age folks, I mean!)---putting US-born girls at a disadvantage!
ReplyDeleteDiscussing the reasons for the lag in collegiate vaulting performance is a big discussion and would take many pages to elucidate. That won't happen in these comments. But you have pointed to something very relevant to the situation in the data you just provided about how FEW girls are on both the HS and collegiate lists. I was going to make a similar, but more general, comment about how poorly many top HS girl vaulters have done in college -- often not even reaching the heights they did in HS, or just barely surpassing them. Your specific data makes this point even more emphatically.
ReplyDeleteAs for the reasons -- again too big of a subject for a brief comment -- I think you have touched on it with the "delayed development" remark. I think it has a lot to do with the way the female body changes during the later stages of physical maturation. To put it simply -- a female body suitable for good pole vaulting in high school may mature into a body less suitable for vaulting by college age. This doesn't happen with boys, where maturation tends to improve the body for vaulting. The same problem is illustrated very dramatically in gymnastics, another sport I follow closely. Again, the girls have difficulties with greater maturation, generally experiencing reduced performance capabilities, while the boys gain advantages with greater maturity. Caveat: there are always exceptions and outliers. Jenn Suhr has the best body for vaulting of any woman I've ever seen in the event -- and she is not a young girl!
This will be my last comment on this post, but you've struck a chord here, my friend!
ReplyDeleteI'm now wondering how many HS Top 24's in EVERY event---indoors & outdoors---made a positive transition to collegiate competition!
I don't think----just thinking off the top of my head, without looking at my Record Book----you'll find much difference in the number of Top 24 HSers who transition well to College in ANY event!
A few events, maybe, but I think most of them, you'd find few athletes on BOTH lists!!
But I really do believe that my "foreign collegian" theme has wheels!
You find a RARE foreigner on my HS lists----Barber is one, and he has dual citizenship! (Thus he competed for Canada and sets Canadian records, but also holds the US HSR outdoors!
But his being a "foreigner" is common to the NCAA in T&F.
So it's far far easier for an American to make the HS lists than it is for them to make a Collegiate list!
Remember, the Women's Outdoor CR holder is Tina Sutej, a European!!
Thanks for this great discussion!
Now for a brief respite----say, 24 hours??----from T&F, so I can come back fresh for my next post....my records predictions for indoors!!
No need for you to respond to this -- I'll look forward to your records predictions post.
ReplyDeleteBut just a remark about comparing HS and collegiate lists in ALL events. Yes, I suspect you'll find that there isn't a huge amount of overlap in most events, but I think different events provide different challenges in this regard. And yes, the "foreign athlete" element is no doubt a factor. But keeping with the theme of the effect of physical maturation, I would say different events are affected differently. For example, the kinds of changes to the body that might work against a female distance runner, or pole vaulter, might not be a negative at all for a thrower. Some bodily changes common among females -- such as broadening of the hips and gaining weight below the waist -- are generally not good for running and jumping, but wouldn't negatively affect a thrower.
The basic problem for girls and women in track and field is that the events were originally designed with the male body in mind. Generally speaking, men evolved over thousands of years of hunter-gatherer life to favor characteristics helpful for hunting and fighting. Women evolved characteristics favorable for childbearing and nurturing. These differences in function, consistent over millenia until very recently, have had a huge factor in the differences in male and female bodies, and thus athletic abilities. It also explains why many top female athletes have at least some physical characteristics (such as larger-than-average size, for example) that are more generally typical of men.
Most, or all, track and field events have their origins in military skills. These have traditionally been male-dominated activities. Therefore women struggle with the events which, for example, emphasize upper body strength, such as the throws and to a large extent, the pole vault. But hunter-gatherer women had to cover long distances on their feet regularly in their nomadic wandering life, just as the men. Therefore women are naturally better adapted for distance running than they are for javelin (spear) throwing. These different aptitudes are seen clearly in the contrasts between male and female performances in the different events.
But I digress...
Nonetheless, all of this leads to an entirely different subject, which perhaps we can discuss some day. It is that I (in a distinct minority) do NOT favor women competing in the decathlon as it is now configured (a very male event). I DO recommend changes to the heptathlon, which is indeed too wimpy for today's women, but not by duplicating the decathlon. I propose making it a more female-oriented multi, more rigorous than today's hep but still taking into account the radical proposition (in today's "politically correct" world) that there actually are differences between men and women! (Your friend Sarah Palin would agree with me on this point.) ;-)
See ya!
OK, one more!
ReplyDeleteHere's my list of the 10 events for a WOMEN's Decathlon!
1. Getting dressed (Includes pantyhose, bra, garters, skirt, blouse, jacket, shoes), and includes time spent DECIDING what to wear!
2. Filling a 12X12 inch purse. Must include at least TWENTY different items!
3. Putting make-up on (Includes mascara, eyeliner, rouge, lipstick, powders!)
4. Baking a roast (Must include the gravy!)
5. Planning a dinner party for a MALE CEO (With a minimum of SIX people--and deciding where they sit!)
6. Going to a Gym-Spa where athlete must partake in FIVE different exercise routines, then get Swedish massage and spend 30 minutes in a tanning salon!
7. Choosing whether to KILL or DIVORCE her abusive husband/lover!
8. Being a SEX OBJECT (Rated the same way Gymnastics is, on a scale of 1 to 10.)
9. Jogging one mile on a metric track. (Includes trying to figure out the difference between a metric mile and a REAL mile!)
10. Writing a Diary entry (Must be 1000 words or longer, and includes 100 drawings of flowers and kittens!)
Hilarious! You've definitely nailed the women's decathlon!
ReplyDelete